How to Move Out of Pain, Unwanted Behavior and Stress with Elisabeth Kristof

“Everything that we experience, our body is experiencing it also. So, if we have a stressful situation, not only are we experiencing that in our mind, but in our body as well.” - Elisabeth Kristof 

I am completely obsessed with somatic intelligence, which is why the conversation I had with today’s Brave By Design guest was so fascinating. A lot of times we try to think our way out of anxiety, depression or other problems, but there is a better way if we work with our body and nervous system - instead of against it. 

Brain-Based Wellness with Elisabeth Kristof is a combo of applied neuroscience training and high-education, high energy at-home workouts that include strategic muscles toning, HIIT cardio and brain-based Pilates.

This wellness practice also includes somatic (body-based) meditation, breath work and cranial nerve stimulation for well-being and nervous system health. This is a space for growth-oriented people to come together and support each other in achieving health and vitality.

Elisabeth and I really only began to scrape the surface in this 30-minute discussion, so I encourage you to try the exercises she described each day to regulate your nervous system, and let us know what it opens up for you. 

Connect with Elisabeth: https://brainbased-wellness.com/ 

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What You’ll Hear In This Episode: 

• Elisabeth’s own story and the extreme trauma she faced that resulted in her life falling apart [1:59]
  
  
• What she learned about her nervous system that allowed her to reconnect with her body and start the recovery process [3:09]
  
  
• The work she now does to teach people how to interrupt a loop that is so harmful to our well-being [5:42]
  
  
• What happens when we don’t feel our way out of stressful situations and change our thoughts around it [6:40]
  
  
• Some common issues that Elisabeth sees in the people she works with, and how she reframed her own visibility in order to help even more people [8:17]
  
  
• A current issue I’m having with my health and the ways that she recommend I address it [15:02]
  
  
• Why people really resist change, and what we can do to make change permanent, rather than just temporary [19:22]
  
  
• How you can start to use the pain you’re feeling as an assessment [28:27] 

Additional Links & Resources:

Elisabeth’s Free Intro to Applied Neurology Course and Morning Practice

Her Instagram 

The Body Keeps the Score: Brain, Mind, and Body in the Healing of Trauma

by Bessel van der Kolk

Transcript

Elisabeth Kristof: 0:00

So everything that we experience our body is experiencing also. And so if we have a stressful situation, not only are we experiencing that in our mind, but in our body as well.

Laura Khalil: 0:13

Welcome to brave by design. I'm your host, Laura Khalil. I'm an entrepreneur, coach and speaker. I love thinking bake, exploring the power of personal development and sharing the best strategies from thought leaders and pioneers in business to empower ambitious women and allies to bravely rise and thrive. Let's get started. Everyone, welcome to this episode of brave by design, you are in for a real treat today because I am speaking with Elizabeth Kristoff, she is an expert in using applied neurology to move people out of pain, unwanted behavior and stress response. She is the founder of brain based wellness, a revolutionary online platform that trains the nervous system and body to resolve old patterns, improve performance and increase well being and who doesn't want that. She's also a certified applied neurology practitioner. She's been involved in the fitness and movement industry since 2007. And, Elizabeth, I am so excited for you to be here.

Elisabeth Kristof: 1:23

Thank you for having me here. I'm really excited to talk to you today.

Laura Khalil: 1:27

You know, it's funny, because I am completely obsessed with somatic intelligence, neurology, a lot of our listeners, you know, one way we could sort of ease into this, as a lot of our listeners have probably heard of the book, the body keeps the score, right. Oh, great.

Elisabeth Kristof: 1:42

That's a huge step in that direction. If you already know that book, that's awesome.

Laura Khalil: 1:46

Yeah. So for people who don't know, why don't you tell us a little bit about your story and how that illustrates, you know, how you even got into this work and what it kind of would mean for the audience.

Elisabeth Kristof: 1:58

I mean, how I got here was the long journey. But I will say that I experienced some real extremes, I feel like sometimes we individually have to go through these really extreme experiences. And it teaches us something that makes visible, what is invisible to a lot of people. And then I can use that experience to then help other people so that they don't have to go through all of the same things. I had a lot of childhood trauma, I was very dissociated from my body for a long time, even though I was teaching movement and fitness. And then I pushed through, I push through, I push through all of that. And then my life really fell apart. My business collapsed, I was in a relationship where my partner was diagnosed with a very rare cancer, and I was taking care of him. And it was scary all of the time. And all this stress was coming into my body that I was used to pushing through so much stress as an athlete as a business owner. But it got to the place where I was so dysregulated, I was in so much pain, I was binge eating so severely, I wasn't able to keep my business, I was in extreme migraine and fatigue. And I started to learn how to take all of this stuff I learned about applied neurology for athletic performance and pain reduction that I used in my movement business for 12 years. And understand that all of our experiences come from our nervous system, all of our behavior comes from my nervous system. And I went down my own long healing path of regulating my own nervous system, after all of that, and learning how to reconnect to my body and how to process that stress through so that I could no longer be driven into those same patterns. And so that I could now come out and and help other people to see how their nervous system is driving their behavior and create this new business, there's no way I would have been able to create this new business without having the tools to process stress and regulate my nervous system after all of that.

Laura Khalil: 4:06

Elizabeth, let me ask you this question. What comes first? And maybe this is the chicken in the egg kind of question. Isn't that I think something and then the nervous system responds to it? Or is it that the nervous system is sort of influencing how I think and respond, or is it both?

Elisabeth Kristof: 4:23

That's a beautiful question. And I believe it's a loop, right? It's circular. And a lot of our nervous system patterns are baked in from infancy, you know, attachment styles or things that happen to us in our early early childhood. There's some really important nerves like your Vegas nerve, which is cranial nerve 10 that sets all of your autonomic functions like your respiration and your heart rate. And so, certain experiences trauma and stress have an impact on those nerves and that starts in early childhood. And then that drives a lot of Thinking, it drives a lot of our behavior because we're always kind of creating a world around us to match up to the stress that we feel inside of our body and our nervous system. And we're all doing the best that we can at the level of our nervous system. So it's very hard to overcome behavior if your nervous system is dysregulated. And it creates a lot of those thought loops and limiting beliefs that we experience. And at the same time, as we get caught in those thought loops, negative thinking, then those create emotions that create chemical reactions inside of our body, and our nervous system responds to those thoughts and emotions. And so the loop gets reinforced. So a lot of what I do is teach people how to interrupt the loop at the level of the body and the nervous system so that it's a real bottom up approach to behavior change, to thought change to cognitive ability, so that you're starting to give your nervous system and your brain stimulation that it's craving that it wants, so that your body, your Vegas nerve, your heart rate, your respiration abilities start to change. And then that is sending a new and different signal to your brain, that you're under less threat.

Laura Khalil: 6:13

Elizabeth, what I hear you saying and this is what's so interesting to me, is a lot of times we try to think our way out of anxiety, depression or a problem, we tried to like, a lot of people say, well just be more positive. And I'm not saying those things are bad. But we often in popular culture, we go to how do I think my way out of this? And what I hear you saying is actually maybe we need to feel our way out of it first, to change the thoughts.

Elisabeth Kristof: 6:40

Yes, I think that there's multiple parts to all of your experiences, and a large part of it happens in your body. So everything that we experience our body is experiencing also. And so if we have a stressful situation, not only are we experiencing that in our mind, but in our body as well, and so that stress needs to be processed through the body, or else it stays in and it starts to create dysregulation and too much stress leads to disease, right diseases, stress is at the root of 70 to 95% of all disease. And so our nervous system and our brain understand that our bodies are intelligent, they have like a higher order intelligence that comes from generations, right? It's passed down in our ancestry, our our nervous system, and we are animals first and human being second. And so there's that kind of animalistic survival response. So when our stress level gets too high, our brain and our central nervous system, and our whole nervous system actually starts to create outputs to try to get us to change our behavior to keep us safe. So when you're in protective mode, you cannot also be in performance mode, those two things don't exist simultaneously.

Laura Khalil: 7:56

So Elizabeth, sorry, let me stop you there. I want to hear a story about this. Because I want to make sure people understand what exactly we're talking about. So tell us a story about like, when does someone come to you? Or what are the type of or very common issues that people would say, Oh, my gosh, I need help. And what do you see?

Elisabeth Kristof: 8:17

So I work with a lot of entrepreneurs, I, myself am an entrepreneur. And there's so many things that we want to do in our business, to put our message out into the world to expand ourselves, right. So we want to be visible, we want to project our message out so that people can hear us and we can reach our clients, we want to stand for our worth. And all of these things are often new behaviors that challenge us in a new way of being. And so cognitively we might understand that being visible, is not threatening to our life, right? In our higher order thinking systems. We know like, it's no big deal, I'm going to go on a podcast, I'm going to share my story, or I'm going to do a post on social media, and I'm going to reach my people. And if some people don't like it, it's okay. But we're social animals. And there is a real physiological response to being rejected to being kicked out of the herd. And that's kind of an anxious response. And so what you might feel in your body, if you took a second and you stopped and you close your eyes, and you just dropped from your head down into your body, what makes it scary? Well, it's the physical response. It's that tightness in your throat, it's your heart racing, maybe your palms get a little bit sweaty. So all of that is our sympathetic nervous system kicking in our fight and flight. And it's the same nervous system response as if you were being chased by a predator. And we're only meant to stay there for a little bit of time. But if we're living a life that's constantly causing us to move into that state, then that becomes really damaging because for instance, all of your blood leaves your Oregon's because it's preparing for you to run right? It needs to go to your muscles to your legs. And so you start to develop digestive issues. Because your gut becomes dysregulated, maybe you start to develop issues with your heart, and chronic pain, muscle tension, right? So we can push through these things cognitively, because we can tell ourselves like, Hey, I can do this, I can put this post on social media. But unless we're doing the work on the back end, or the front end of that, to regulate our nervous system, and to process the stress through our body, eventually, our nervous system starts to shut us down. So a lot of my people will be kind of high driving people, often entrepreneurs, creatives who want to put their message out, and they can do it. But then what happens is on the back end of that, they start to experience protective outputs of their nervous system, like they get chronic migraines, or depression. Or, for instance, I would do this podcast with you maybe, and I'm someone who visibility is hard for me, I grew up with trauma. And I learned at an early age that staying invisible is safer, right? Because people are unpredictable. So as I've started to put myself out into the world, I'm trying to bake in this new belief that visibility is an act of service. Visibility protects me. And I can do that. And I could have this interview with you because I believe in my purpose, and I want to put this out into the world. But then maybe later tonight, I would get a really bad migraine, or maybe in two days, I would just find myself exhausted and have to sleep or I would binge eat, binge eating is a huge output of my nervous system to kind of shut me down. So I could push through it, but then my brain would be too threatened. And I would go into a kind of a protective survival response afterwards. And I would be constantly getting held back by my nervous system. And so Intel, I learned some tools to regulate my nervous system through applied neurology and to stimulate certain important nerves. I'll do that now before I have this interview with you. And I did some neuro drills. Afterwards, I'll do the same thing, some self soothing tools that will help me be able to do the work that I want to do in the world, but not get shut down by a nervous system that's trying to hold me back. keep me safe.

Laura Khalil: 12:19

This is really interesting. Does it also lead to so what I hear you saying is anytime I'm trying to do something big, that's outside of my comfort zone, I may be prone to having a response in the nervous system that feels uncomfortable. And that response may lead me to do things that are dis regulate the nervous system in the body in ways that can lead to illness that can lead to binge eating and stuff like that. Is it also for people can it just eventually be a form of self sabotage.

Elisabeth Kristof: 12:52

It's interesting, it is a form of self sabotage to our higher self. But at the level of our subconscious mind at the level of our brainstem, our brain's primary job is our survival. And it is always deciding safe, unsafe, safe, unsafe in that moment, so it doesn't have your long term future goals in mind, it doesn't have your growth as a human being or, you know, your big business goals in mind, it is always concerned with right now, right here, what can I do to keep you alive. And so the safer our subconscious mind feels, the more it will allow us to take on things that cause a little bit of stress and a little bit of dysregulation without moving into those negative unwanted outputs. So if you think of your nervous system as a bucket, all of the stress of your life is getting put into that bucket. And that can be financial stress, relationship stress, it can also be unhealed injuries or body mapping abilities, maybe a little bit of a deficit in your balance system. Or maybe you have a deficit in your eyes and your visual system. And that's causing stress on a second by second basis. So you have all these different types of stress going into the bucket. And we're meant to be pretty resilient. But again, our brain and our nervous system know that too much stress for too long is dangerous and leads to disease, and it leads to mental illness. So it will start to generate outcomes to try to get you to keep your world smaller so that you stay safe. So as you start to heal those deficits in your nervous system, and process stress through your body somatically that threat level in the bucket starts to go down, the water in the bucket goes down. And when the water in the bucket goes down, you suddenly have more room to take on stress. You can take in more stuff without experiencing those negative outputs.

Laura Khalil: 14:55

So here's what I got to ask you because this is so interesting to me. Here's one for you. Let's work Through is like a personal case study. Sure, back in, we're recording this in February back in beginning of November, I made this commitment that I was really going to start working out regularly. And I did. And it was great, and I was feeling really good. And then I began to develop some really terrible pain in my elbow, to the point where I actually couldn't work out anymore. So I went to go see an acupuncturist to sort of work on it wasn't that helpful? You know, I have like, you know, topical cream I component, but I'm really stuck. And I'm like, kind of pissed off and annoyed, because this seems to be Elizabeth, a repeating pattern that I often get sports injuries, whenever I try to start a new sort of sport routine. So what the hell is going on?

Elisabeth Kristof: 15:56

really common, and you're not alone. 70 to 90% of people quit movement exercise regime because they get injured or because they don't get the results that they want. And from an applied neurology perspective, you know, they've done a bunch of studies, and they label people as non responders to exercise. And that's insane. Because we are me move. And if you think of like a gazelle in the wilderness, who doesn't respond well to movement that because I was just lunch, you know, that's not there's something wrong with the system, right. And so what it's not looking at is that everybody's nervous system is so unique, everybody's life experiences are so unique, and we're all under different stresses in our life at the moment. So there's a concept called minimum effective dose. And one of the things that I really work with on my clients is understanding the appropriate amount of stimulus, whether that's exercise, whether that's neuro drills, whether that's any kind of stimulus you're putting into your life, so that you're working at the right dosage for your body and your nervous system. At that time. If a bell curve, at the very top of the bell curve is kind of your sweet spot, you're giving yourself a certain amount of exercise, and you're getting really positive returns. But if you had a headache, you wouldn't take just a tiny sliver of Tylenol because it wouldn't do anything, right, you would need more stimulus than that. But you also wouldn't take the whole bottle because it would kill you. Right. So exercise, and neurology is the same way you're looking for your right dosage, so that you get positive returns, but you're not exceeding that minimum effective dosage so that you don't start to move into negative returns like weight gain, like fatigue, or injury and pain. So pain is a protective output of your brain. Oftentimes, there's no acute injury associated with it. Or maybe there's an old acute injury just means those pain pathways are more well worn, it's a well worn path for your brain to send you a signal that you're under too much stress. So maybe you have a lot of stress in your life this year. So do a lot of people. It's an incredibly stressful time, there's a pandemic, there's social justice, there's financial concerns, and then you're adding the stress of exercise on top of that, which is important movement is great to process stress through your body, but it needs to be at the right dose. So your brain was sending you a signal, hey, there's too much stress right now. And so we could find ways neurologically to heal some of the deficits in your nervous system so that you're under less threat on a second by second basis. And then you would be able to take the stress of the exercise and get positive returns from it. Because again, that water level in the bucket is lower.

Laura Khalil: 18:58

So Elizabeth, it makes a lot of sense. And I love that you call it like a minimum viable dose. Is that what you said?

Elisabeth Kristof: 19:04

Yes, minimum effective dose. But yeah, effective dose? Yes.

Laura Khalil: 19:08

I love that. I wonder too, for people like I think about myself. And I wonder, is it a self protective mechanism to not change?

Elisabeth Kristof: 19:19

Yes. So change is threatening to our old brain just inherently our brains are again, wired for our survival and always deciding safe, unsafe. And they do that through prediction, which is based on pattern recognition. So the easier it is for your brain to make predictions, the safer your brain feels. So if you're changing, especially habitual behaviors, that's very threatening to your brain because now it's more energy costly for your brain to have to make those predictions that it needs to make to ensure your survival. So if you do the same thing again, Day, in the same order at the same time, it's easy for your brain to predict what's going to happen. And when all of a sudden, you start to shake that up, and you're like, I'm going to wake up at a different time, I'm going to add this new thing into my life, I'm going to engage in some different behaviors. Your brain is like, what, whoa, whoa, whoa, wait, what's going on, I don't have the pattern for this, I don't know how to make predictions, and therefore I don't feel as safe. So another really important part of nervous system regulation is learning these little tools that in the moment, you can apply to your brain into your nervous system to make that threat level go down, so that then you are capable of carrying out the change, because your back brain is always going to win over your frontal lobe in that situation, it's gonna eventually pull you back, because that's just the way we're wired.

Laura Khalil: 20:48

So it sounds like for any change, whether you are, let's say, for people who are on a weight loss journey are for people who want to have a new different eating habit, or they want to find a new job, or they want to expand their business in a certain way. Yes, it sounds like the best way to get started when we talk about that minimum effective dose is not to kind of do a whole 180. But it is to make small deliberate habit changes is is that kind of where you're headed?

Elisabeth Kristof: 21:25

Yes, absolutely. And needs to start in small changes that are sustainable. In applied neurology, there's a saying of like, make the change. So small, so easy, that you can't mess it up, like set it at something that you would think like, that's not even a challenge. That's not even a thing to think about. And because your brain also needs success, it needs to have success for those reward centers to go off for behavior change to become possible. So you set it at something, if you want to start walking, maybe instead of like 10,000 steps a day, you set it at 5000. And you're like, that seems so easy, I don't even know that I probably already do that. That's okay, set it at that. And then gradually, in a very calibrated way, build on from there, because all behavior change is threatening. And so you have to go up against your nervous system, when you're doing that. And especially things like eating behaviors and behaviors that are deeply related to our survival, and our fuel supply will quickly become very threatening to your brain, the body likes to write. So when we start to change up what we're eating, and the amount of calories we're consuming, that is your brain quickly, will go into rebellion against that.

Laura Khalil: 22:46

Okay, and so because everyone's nervous system is unique, I imagine you're going to tell me, there's not one specific amount of time you talk about changing and very calibrated ways, but it's probably not the same for everyone. Correct?

Elisabeth Kristof: 23:02

That's right. So everybody is so different. And that's one of the things I really try to do on my site is teach people how to be the expert of your own nervous system. And one of the best ways to do that is to just constantly assess and reassess things. So change at the level of your nervous system is instantaneous. So I'll just walk you through a really quick drill. So yeah, see what I mean by this. And listeners can certainly do this as well. So just sit nice and tall, lengthen your spine, take a breath and kind of drop into your body. And just internally feel how you feel. And especially notice the amount of tension in your neck, and how easily are quickly you are breathing and see if you can breathe down into your belly. And just to kind of take an internal gauge, do you have pain anywhere, what's your energy like, and then open your eyes if they're closed and just turn your head side to side and look out of the corner of your eyes and see how far you can see as you turn your head like Mark with your eyes how far your head is rotating, and also feel if you feel tension in your throat. And then we'll come back to a neutral position of your head. So you're just looking straight forward with a nice tall spine. And we're going to just make some circles with our tongue. So the Vegas nerve innervates the tongue. So if we want to give the Vegas nerve, some stimulus, tongue movement is a great way to do that. So you're just going to take your tongue over your teeth and circle around your mouth trying to go a little bit further back with each rotation. And we'll do three circles in each direction. So you'll make three big circles with your tongue in one direction. And then you'll pause and then you'll go the other direction, making three big circles with your chunk. Trying to go a little further back each time. See if you can really touch those back molars. And then come back. Let your tongue just rest in your mouth. Take a breath in, take a breath out, letting that settle into your body and then reassess. Turn your head from side to side. Notice If your range of motion got better notice if you feel a little less tension in your neck or in your throat, and then notice also too, if your respiration changes, if it slows down a little bit, if there's less tension in your throat, then that would be a positive response. So you can see and feel how your nervous system instantaneously responds to something. Did you feel any difference when you did that?

Laura Khalil: 25:24

Well, I have to tell you, I feel just generally like better, right. But I am sort of shocked because when we did the head turning thing, I didn't realize how much less I could see under my left side out of my peripheral vision. And I was kind of like, what the hell is going on here? Okay,

Elisabeth Kristof: 25:47

great. So one drill that I would do with you and anyone else who like maybe one side, their vision was restricted, we could easily think of another drill for your visual system that might be really positive for you, which would be to hold your head, still take your thumb out in front of your face, and just track your phone out to the left and what's called a smooth pursue, and bring it back to center. So you're going to keep your eyes on your thumb, and just follow it out to the left as far as you can. Maybe one more time, doing that slowly and really keeping your eyes on the target. And only doing it as far as you can without creating any tension in your face or clenching your jaw. And then when you're done with that, take a breath in, take a nice long exhale. And then again, reassess the tension in your neck, turn your head from side to side, I notice how your nervous system responded to that.

Laura Khalil: 26:39

That completely fixed it.

Elisabeth Kristof: 26:41

Yeah. So it's really neat, when you start to learn how to work with the nervous system, because it's very intelligently designed, and it's very responsive change at the level of the nervous system is instantaneous. So you can constantly assess and reassess for yourself is this stimulus, something that my nervous system responds well to? Is this something that threatens my nervous system. So if when you did those drills, you found all of a sudden you had more tension in your neck or your heart started to beat a little faster, or your range of motion was reduced when you turn your head, then that would mean that it was too much stimulus for your nervous system, it was something that it didn't want at that moment in time. So that would not be the drill for you. And then you can start to use that to assess lots of things in your life. Does it help you when you meditate? Or does it actually make you feel more threatened? Maybe you should go for a walk instead? Does it help you when you take a bath? Does your workout reduce your stress level? Does your nervous system respond well to that? Or are you getting worse every time he workout and start to learn to read your body's internal signals and what your nervous system is telling you. So that you can be guiding all of these things in your life to move you forward in a positive, more regulated state of your nervous system, rather than pushing into stress and dysregulation, which will then create those outputs like the pain.

Laura Khalil: 28:13

Elizabeth, here's what I'm curious about when we're trying to assess how things feel like a bubble bath, versus a shower or meditation versus a walk and stuff like that. How do we do that?

Elisabeth Kristof: 28:27

very much the same way, I would find a range of motion, maybe something that I have difficulty with. and assess my range of motion, I would also sworn after, before and after. Okay. And I would also maybe spend 30 seconds like go inside of my body and notice, see if I can tell if my heart rate is increasing or decreasing. If my muscle tension is increasing or decreasing and your pain, if you do something in your elbow pain is worse after that is a negative output. That is a response from your nervous system that it didn't like that it was too much or it was stimulus that it didn't need or was creating more imbalance in your body. So you could use your pain as an assessment. Do I get better? Or do I get worse? evening rod? Huh? Absolutely.

Laura Khalil: 29:15

That's incredible. And so for everyone who's listening to this, go do that exercise that Elizabeth just gave us and try that out in your you know, scenarios. And, you know, we have not even really scraped the surface

Elisabeth Kristof: 29:33

to get to Yeah,

Laura Khalil: 29:35

I love it. Wow, this is so powerful. Elizabeth, thank you so much for joining us. And I know for people listening, people are probably dying to figure out like, how do I learn more about this? Where can I find more so Elizabeth, tell us where can people take the next steps if they want to learn more.

Elisabeth Kristof: 29:54

So you can visit my website it's brain based dash wellness dot Tom, and I have a free applied neurology course there that will teach you how to assess and reassess your own nervous system. it'll teach you a little bit more about high applied neurology works. And it'll also give you five of the drills that I found to be most helpful for a large number of people that you can incorporate into a short morning practice. So all together, they take maybe three to five minutes. And if you do that every morning, and you start to bring your nervous system into a better state in the morning, or you do it every time before, after you are going to do something stressful, you will be amazed at how your life changes as you start to spend just even a little bit amount of time regulating your nervous system. It will open up so much more.

Laura Khalil: 30:46

Incredible. Well, gosh, thank you so much for joining us on this episode of brave by design.

Elisabeth Kristof: 30:51

Thank you for having me.

Laura Khalil: 30:54

I want to thank you for joining me and remember to subscribe to your favorite app so you can stay up to date, and I would love your review. If you've enjoyed this episode. Please leave a review and comment on Apple podcasts. You can also keep in touch with me online. You can find me on LinkedIn and I'm also on Instagram at force of badassery. All that information will be available in the show notes. Until next time, stay brave